|
http://forum.brokeroutpost.com/loans/forum/2/38951.htm
Loan Officer Forum
Home | Loan Officer Topics | Register | Login | Mortgage Broker
Directory
All Forums
General Discussion
Announcements
Search for: Who was the all time Worst Lead Vendor ?.
Related tags: [leads, scam, ]
Author Previous Topic | Next Topic
a11b22
2 Posts
Posted - 05/26/2006 : 12:43:15 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hello all, I have been reading this board for some time as a lurker and
have found it really informative and helpful. I thought it was time to
begin to contribute and so I just registered. My first post is going to
hopefully elicit some emotional responses? Who is the worst lead
vendor/supplier you have ever dealt with? who has lied, cheated and
scammed you worse than any of the others? I of course have my personal
'favorite' and quite a story it is, but before I let loose with my
calvacade of sorrow and treachery, i'd like to hear who makes your
list.
Tsnyder
2808 Posts
Posted - 05/26/2006 : 1:04:13 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I think you could throw most of them in a
hat, draw a name, and not be wrong... lol
Tsnyder
blokk
561 Posts
Posted - 05/26/2006 : 1:08:56 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Lending Hope on my list
sugar land
130 Posts
Posted - 05/26/2006 : 1:59:33 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Netskrill!
abed_converimax
204 Posts
Posted - 05/26/2006 : 2:08:19 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
WETLEADS
LEADBULL
GolfLoaner
334 Posts
Posted - 05/26/2006 : 2:23:22 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I agree. Netskrill. He's since been banned from the site, but if you
see that name, run away.
Oh yeah, and Leadbull. These guys are horrible. 100% of the leads are
bogus.
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by sugar land
Netskrill!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
midas
4232 Posts
Posted - 05/26/2006 : 5:13:42 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
lendinghope
chezwick
2446 Posts
Posted - 05/26/2006 : 6:10:32 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Avoid these unscrupulous "lead" websites:
www.HotSatinLeads.com
www.LeadExorcist.com
www.DaVinciCodeLeads.com
www.MutantLeads.com
www.TheLeadLessTraveled.com
www.RichLeadPoorLead.com
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by midas
lendinghope
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
gwagner
893 Posts
Posted - 05/26/2006 : 7:30:26 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by chezwick
Avoid these unscrupulous "lead" websites:
www.HotSatinLeads.com
www.LeadExorcist.com
www.DaVinciCodeLeads.com
www.MutantLeads.com
www.TheLeadLessTraveled.com
www.RichLeadPoorLead.com
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by midas
lendinghope
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dag nab it chezwick www.DaVinciCodeLeads.com was suposed to be a
SECRET!! PLEASE tell me that you didn't tell them about
www.theknightsoftemplar.com TOO.
badam61
287 Posts
Posted - 05/27/2006 : 4:19:19 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Alansis.....(or "scam-lansis" as Erik says...still laughing over that
one!)
a11b22
2 Posts
Posted - 05/30/2006 : 2:36:02 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Well, I've heard of some of these outfits before, and now I'll be
sure to avoid them. Let me add my vote for Worst Lead Company, americas
lead source http://www.americasleadsource.comI just checked their
website again, its changed from when I purchased my leads from them 4
weeks ago, look good, that must be where my money went, it certainly
did not go into getting good quality leads! Long story short, they
promised the moon, delivered . . . well, put it this way, calling their
leads excrement is being charitable.
jandrews
590 Posts
Posted - 05/31/2006 : 07:57:42 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tele Ten out of CA and YES Lending Hope -
blokk
561 Posts
Posted - 05/31/2006 : 10:09:00 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I'd like to say Lending Hope again, in case noone got the message.
LENDING HOPE!!!!
csmith51
94 Posts
Posted - 06/01/2006 : 07:37:41 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Never use www.netleads.com, never had one pan out.
jmbradburn
53 Posts
Posted - 06/01/2006 : 3:01:03 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
As a Lead Provider myself I cannot believe brokers buy leads from some
of these companies. I talk to brokers everyday and we have never been
on any list in regards to poor leads...and I still find it hard for
brokers to buy Experian's quality product. I guess people get what they
pay for and will justify getting burned when they only have to output
$10-$20 a lead. We have been providing double scrubbed telemarketed
leads from Experian for the last 5 years and are yet to be on a "worst
lead provider" list I guess thats why we have 70% client retention
Point being---what do people expect when they buy $5-$10 leads from
these companies
abibbs
734 Posts
Posted - 06/01/2006 : 11:13:05 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Paul Horner (Netskrill) was certainly the funniest. He swore up and
down the Church of Scientology was after him and even posted storys
about it on SEVERAL web sites.
And for any of you who didnt grow up around (Bay Area)Rap/Hip-Hop,
Skrill is slang for, yes, CASH.
Hence the word "Skrillionaire". I had a hard time taking someone
serious that named their "company" Net Skrill. I dont think people even
use that word anymore. Well, not COOL people anyway. ;]
MortgagePimp
62 Posts
Posted - 06/02/2006 : 06:13:12 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I know its been mentioned a couple of time already but incase anybody
missed it. LENDING HOPE!......Looks like they are in the lead for the
worst.
midas
4232 Posts
Posted - 06/02/2006 : 08:04:42 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
lendinghope is still calling me soliciting business after they stole
over $7000 from me. they run under the name m revolution now please
call douglas shedd 877-536-3467 ext238 and demand they pay back
everyones money that they have stolen. we made enough impact to make
them change their name so if we keep the pressure on they will have to
close down or pay us back. douglas@mrevolution.com please help me out
so no one else has to suffer.
azbroker
826 Posts
Posted - 06/02/2006 : 10:55:24 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Alanis without a doubt. Horrible...
blokk
561 Posts
Posted - 06/03/2006 : 03:30:36 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Lendinghope! Again
jwcooke
142 Posts
Posted - 06/03/2006 : 10:55:30 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Teleten for us. Just a terrible company.
11Bravo
46 Posts
Posted - 06/06/2006 : 9:02:13 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I realize that this is about the BAD GUYS. But, I think there is a lot
to consider when discussing the lead vs the company you bought them
from and under what conditions you bought them. Certainly, in these
days of electronic long-range business dealings where the average guy
does business NATIONWIDE over the internet, it is predictable that
scams will abound. Twenty years ago, if you dealt with a product or
service on a national basis, chances are you had great references, and
introduction, etc. Today, a guy throws up a cheap website, starts
spamming the hell out of you, and after a year of spamming you think
he's legit. RULE 1: ALWAYS GET REFERENCES IN AT LEAST TWO OTHER STATES
THAN WHERE THE SELLER IS. This only helps, but does not guarantee that
he is legit, as he might have buddies all over the nation, all doing
the same thing, selling the same leads over and over and over.
We used to spend between 10 and 15K a month on leads from various
sources. We did quite a bit of research before selecting from whom we
would purchase leads. Often, the leads were bogus, but not because of
the lead seller, alone. It is a combination of "somewhat" deceptive
marketing by the lead generator and an unwillingness by the borrower to
come off of his/her personal information.
Here is how it typically works;
The borrower logs on at Yahoo or MSN, etc. While surfing, or posting
messages, doing emails, he sees banners everywhere. Eventually he
clicks one. They see flashing lites that say "QUICK MORTGAGE RATES
NOW!" The person figures "Okay! I can compare my rate with this"
In order to do that, borrower needs to give up some info, which creates
the lead.
Borrower/savvy internet users knows the game and becomes Magilla
Gorilla or Superman, at 1234 Main st in Bumpharg, Idaho. When the form
is complete and Superman clicks the button, his suspicions are confimed
and, instead of rates, he gets Bubkus...and a note that tells him that
he can now choose from a list and have up to 4 lenders contact him to
quote him a rate. HAHAHHAHA... now, he gets the privilege of having not
ONE, but FOUR calls, right in a row! One after the other..at work!
Niiiiicceee!! If you are the fourth guy, how bad do think this guy
wants to talk to you?
First guy who calls the trusting borrower, (who really fills the lead
form out with real information.. not really a savvy guy), quotes some
bogus rate, tells them NOT to let anyone else pull credit, lest their
score will drop... and so on. If the customer falls for that bull, then
the lead will come alive again in about 6 weeks, right after that poor
sap finds out he has been lied to about the rate, etc. Save the ones
you failed to convert that first day and then use them, again. I'll
guarantee you that any of them who had even decent credit and still
do not have a loan, will think they are hearing angels sing when you
call.
I think the ratio of real people filling out those things, (from legit
companies)was at best, 50%. If the name was right, phone was not, email
was not, etc. Different companies have different ideas as to exactly
WHAT constitutes a lead. I believe the closing ratio was in the 1%
range.
So, do I've a hated lead guy? No. I think the people we did business
with gave us what they said they would. They never told us that EVERY
LEAD WOULD BE LEGIT and offered to give us credit for the super hero
leads.
Leads are only as good as the intention of the borrower.
jwcooke
142 Posts
Posted - 06/06/2006 : 10:00:34 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
11Bravo,
You said, "Leads are only as good as the intention of the borrower."
While that may be true, companies that sell leads without a thought to
the "intention of the borrower" are probably the companies listed here
in this post.
I will agree that a "legitimate" lead is somewhat relative. What counts
for one LO may not count for another...but absolutey bogus leads or
companies who don't complete their orders is a different story. I have
done business with lead providers we had little success with, but I
would not list them as a "bad lead provider". It's just that the
particular batch we received from their company didn't work...I think
most people can tell the difference.
I do feel for the good lead companies though. How frustrating it must
be as a good lead provider to send your good leads to crappy closers
and then have them come on a forum like this and ***** about the
company. If I ran a lead company, I think I'd interview LO's
considering using my service and listen to their sales pitch. If I
delivered live transfers, I'd listen to the conversation and make
sure they knew how to take an application and set themselves up to sell
the loan.
Really, I've three requirements of lead companies I'm working with
or considering working with. The borrower has to be interested, (Show
somewhat of an interest in talking to someone about their situation
with their mortgage) friendly, (I.E. Doesn't scream and curse at you or
hang up on you immediately) and financeable. (Have SOME possibility of
being financed) Other than that, I really put it on the individual LO
on where it goes from there.
Honestly, what really matters is your ROI...which we measure in cost
per funded loan. I have found most companies are in the $600-$1000 range,
with a few above and below that, depending on the company, the
particular batch, etc. Everything else is just how much time you want
to spend wasting your time with crappier leads and trying to get credit
for them.
For example, if a lead company only charges $2.00 per lead, but you
have to go through 350 of them to have a closed loan, that's quite a
bit of wasted time calling each one, starting with a customer to have
them drop out, etc. BUT...if you find a company that charges $250 a
lead but you can fund one out of four leads, I would MUCH rather use that
company, even though the cost per funded loan is higher. ($1000 as
compared to $750 with the other lead company) Even with the higher cost
per funded loan, the time spent with the second company is so much
less...it becomes totally worth it as you can "ramp up" with them and
have a ton of loans closed.
jmbradburn
53 Posts
Posted - 06/07/2006 : 09:52:27 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
11bravo,
Have you looked into Experian's new Target Event...their Trigger
program? I'd be curious as to what you think about it because it is
producing some great results right now. I'd be more than happy to
get you the information or go over the product with you. It does
alleviate some of the issues you stated earlier, that other lead
generation programs create
jbradburn@imcmarketing.com
feyita
22 Posts
Posted - 06/08/2006 : 06:41:25 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
How about we get a little more postitive here in this forum...Who would
you say is the BEST lead provider out there? I have only used two
companies so my knowledge is limited. I had the worst results I could
even imagine with LeadBull, but I have been doing great with
juicyleads.com....what about you?
Dennis_IL
189 Posts
Posted - 06/08/2006 : 11:34:36 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by feyita
How about we get a little more postitive here in this forum...Who would
you say is the BEST lead provider out there? I have only used two
companies so my knowledge is limited. I had the worst results I could
even imagine with LeadBull, but I have been doing great with
juicyleads.com....what about you?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
mmmmmm?.....positive?.......mmmmmmmm? Nope! no one comes to mind.
tabithanaylor
48 Posts
Posted - 06/29/2006 : 08:55:31 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah, I cant think of any positive ones either. NetLeads was just
terrible. I think using them was the worst, at least for us here.
louisfanucchi
6 Posts
Posted - 06/29/2006 : 09:13:17 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
They all suck!!!!!!
GolfLoaner
334 Posts
Posted - 06/29/2006 : 11:52:55 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I've found none that I'd recommend. It's been said over and over
again by many different people and it's the truth... Spend your money
on some form of marketing that will make your phone ring instead. Don't
buy leads. 99.99999% of the companies are bogus. And good luck finding
the .00001% that are legit, because anyone working with that .00001% of
lead providers is not ever going to tell you who they are. They do not
want to lose all the good leads.
I am sure every lead provider will now chime in and say how they are the
.00001% that is good. Don't hold your breath. Unless a lead provider
specifically comes highly recommended from a trusted source, I wouldn't
even speculate. That's just my opinion after much trial and error. Most
lead providers lie so much upfront that I swear they actually believe
what they're saying. Don't believe me? Ask jmbradburn what his closing
ratio is on his "trigger leads". That one always makes me laugh. If you
believe the number he posts in response, you deserve the fleecing that
you'll most likely receive.
Think of lead providers as mortgage brokers, only now you're the
borrower. They will say anything to "close the deal". They will promise
the world. Then, when they do not deliver the results, they'll say "hmm,
that's weird. It must be you, 'cause every other broker we work with is
closing tons of loans off these." Lead providers are like that dreaded
broker that you never want to have to sell against. The one who will
lie and say whatever it takes to steal the loan from you. And just like
the cheating broker who will "bait and switch" the borrower after they
have them on the hook, so too will you be "baited and switched." Except
by the time you realize it, it's already too late. They've already got
your money and you've signed a contract that says you're entitled to $0
if you're not happy. And I thought brokers were bad.
I say all of this in an effort to save you from the same fate that many
of us here have already experienced. Learn from our mistakes and save
your money.
So I guess what I am saying is do not buy leads if you can help it.
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by feyita
How about we get a little more postitive here in this forum...Who would
you say is the BEST lead provider out there? I have only used two
companies so my knowledge is limited. I had the worst results I could
even imagine with LeadBull, but I have been doing great with
juicyleads.com....what about you?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
feyita
22 Posts
Posted - 06/29/2006 : 12:21:37 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Well, to speak out against that I'm having good luck with my lead
provider and I'm more than willing to tell you who they are, I just
chose not say anything out in the open forum bceause I have seen to many
lead salesmen chim ein. As some of you know from having e-mailed me I
have told you who I'm working with. The company that I get my leads
from never made me unrealistic promises or tried to sell me on hype.
Actually they were the lowest numbers that anyone promised me and they
have delivered enough return that I continue to buy. I guess according
to GolfLoaner I just won the lottery. Trigger leads are BS and I have
known that for awhile and I am new to this industry. With these leads I
consider it a FORM of marketing, not my ONLY form of marketing. Follow
up wioth me if you want, but I just do not think it is good to get
together in a forum that could do so much good and gossip like hens.
loanbanker
639 Posts
Posted - 06/29/2006 : 1:08:42 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
definitely LEADBULL and leads-for-less.com
What I dont get is with all the people who have been burned on leads,
why arent you all premium members generating your own leads for 10
bucks a month?
erikwebster
552 Posts
Posted - 06/30/2006 : 6:35:30 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ring India, resold exclusive telemarking leads.
rayray
36 Posts
Posted - 07/01/2006 : 02:33:01 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
i bought 25 leads from paul at netskrill. didn't close any, but had
good conversations with most of them. i copied his system for lead
generation and now get 3-5 'purchase' lead applications a week
completed on my website. best $100 dollars i have ever spent on leads.
erikwebster
552 Posts
Posted - 07/02/2006 : 9:57:28 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by rayray
i bought 25 leads from paul at netskrill. didn't close any, but had
good conversations with most of them. i copied his system for lead
generation and now get 3-5 'purchase' lead applications a week
completed on my website. best $100 dollars i have ever spent on leads.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Whats his system?
jmbradburn
53 Posts
Posted - 07/05/2006 : 09:03:52 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Golfloaner,
First off no need to bring me into this until you have tried the leads
and have first hand knowledge. That is why the money back guarantee is
there..for people like you, if you would try them rather than slander
and they didnt work out then you could get your money back. Also why do
you think we have 80-85% renewal business on these leads...I dont think
people would buy again if they got burnt. Oh and how would we have been
in business for the last 10 years. Alot of people have been burned and
that gives the solid lead providers a bad wrap also.
blokk
561 Posts
Posted - 07/06/2006 : 10:26:52 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I've to say it one more time....Lendinghope
hoangad
467 Posts
Posted - 07/06/2006 : 2:44:49 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
lol at lending hope leads.
realdealphil lol
cachebroker
802 Posts
Posted - 07/06/2006 : 2:57:32 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by erikwebster
Whats his system?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
his system was simple. He would advertise 100% Owner Will carry/ Lease
option homes on Craigslist or any other free web advertisement out
there. So, these folks would go on to his website to put in their
contact info and then he'd sell them for about $5/each. The "borrower"
who didnt think they'd be eligible for a loan in the 1st place(hence
inquiring about 100% carry back financing) now get a call from a
mortgage broker who will then spend $25 on them by pulling credit only
to see the massive lists of collections and BKs on their report.
Douggie
639 Posts
Posted - 07/06/2006 : 7:05:58 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I didnt see anything about .
Pioneer info and marketing
Dont forget about my situation with them.The guy took my money, sent me
something other then what was ordered......then told me to go shove it.
Thats not the best part......just in the month after that. I was trying
to find a way to re coup my money and I found 2 others he did the same
thing to.
roslyngrant@sbcg
1100 Posts
Posted - 07/07/2006 : 1:48:03 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
24/7 mortgage leads..terrible customer service and didn't close one,
also didn't get the credits they advertised for incorrect info..what
else is new?
A2ZLoans
172 Posts
Posted - 07/07/2006 : 9:15:15 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
jmbradburn email a price sheet for your Experian Trigger Leads. You
sent me a email Friday but no price sheet. I will try them and give the
boys a non biased grade. Can you query just ARM too?
jmbradburn
53 Posts
Posted - 07/10/2006 : 07:40:58 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
sent you over another email
feyita
22 Posts
Posted - 07/10/2006 : 12:10:06 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
What do you guys know about Trigger Leads? The company I buy leads from
just started offering them
jmbradburn
53 Posts
Posted - 07/10/2006 : 12:27:11 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I'd be more than happy to answer whatever concerns you have about
Trigger Programs without any sales talk
MattLuck
97 Posts
Posted - 07/10/2006 : 1:26:26 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
www.conventionalmarketing.com is pretty good.. Leads are above average
and at a good wholesale price.
kortas
64 Posts
Posted - 07/10/2006 : 1:52:02 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
That's rather amusing to hear so much about NetSkrill. Paul Horner used
to work for me as a Loan Officer, and WOW, that is one shady character.
I also heard the stories about Tom Cruise being after him.
He used to give me his leads for free, and I still refused to work
them. That is a bad source of leads if they're free and someone still
refuses to work them.
They were great if you were looking for Rent 2 Own leads that cannot
qualify to buy a bicycle. I did close a couple, but I received
thousands to do that. And my credit report bill was outrageous. Every
buyer gave you their credit but it was always a 400 credit score.
TimmyZ1
47 Posts
Posted - 07/11/2006 : 09:30:49 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
We used Lower my bills and Nextag and there pretty good, Nextag was
having some serious issues with sending us to many purchase leads but
have acknowledged they have a problem and have refunded some leads and
supposedly are working on the problem
|
|
Worst Mortgage Lead Companies
